Hey there, adamant non-smokers, let’s have a chat!
I happened to run across this article in a local paper today while working on some other stuff, and decided to fire out some discourse on the subject really quick:
The long story short is that the Ohio County Health Department of Ohio County, West Virginia (Wheeling is the County seat) is considering modifying their exemption for parlors and Wheeling Island Hotel-Casino-Racetrack as pertains their indoor and outdoor clean air act.
It should come as no surprise that the casino, as well as bars and slot parlors, oppose this measure adamantly. Of course, rather than conjecture-based guesses, the casino has definitive proof that eliminating the ability of gamblers to smoke in the establishment is a terrible idea.
The article speaks on neighboring Hancock County, which effectuated such an action against Mountaineer Casino, Racetrack and Resort (for whatever reason, both casinos like to include everything that is there in the official name) in 2015. That action caused Mountaineer’s gambling revenues to plummet 19.2% to the tune of $25,000,000, in the first full year of the smoking ban. Much of that revenue was lost to Wheeling Island Hotel-Casino-Racetrack-Food Court-Buffet-Poker Room-Water Fountain-Public Restrooms (making fun of the name) as that was the next closest casino for many of Mountaineer’s visitors.
Other Mountaineer players defected to other casinos in the general area, such as The Meadows and Rivers Casino, both in Pennsylvania. (Pennsylvania Casinos like topographical names, Mt. Airy, Presque Isle Downs, Valley Forge and Lady Luck Nemacolin Woodlands Resort Casino are other examples)
Furthermore, and unfortunately I do not have any hard numbers to provide, but if you’ll take my word for it the number of operating gambling parlors in Hancock County dropped like a bowling ball off of the Eiffel Tower during this time. Again, I did not drive through the whole of that county and count them, but in the areas that I happen to be around on occasion, I can assure you that there were fewer open parlors and more empty buildings!
There was unanimous agreement in the meetings as to the economic impacts that banning smoking in the casinos and parlors would have, but that was handily dismissed by an argument that basically amounts to, “Icky smokers are bad, bad, people.”
For those of you who are unfamiliar with the area, let me explain, essentially, how the Ohio County Clean Air Act works as pertains to indoor smoking:
There are essentially four categories of business that are permitted to allow smoking on their premises, and I will detail them below:
1.) The Casino
Wheeling Island Hotel-Casino-Racetrack-Parking Lot-Another Parking Lot is permitted to allow smoking within the building as long as it otherwise complies (or attempts) with the outdoor aspect of the act. What that means is that they are to post signs within a certain number of feet of their entrances saying that smoking is not allowed past that point (while outdoors). Once people go past any of the security podiums and onto the casino floor, then they may smoke again if they choose.
Any areas that are not directly on the casino floor are non-smoking, and the casino has a non-smoking area of limited use for non-smokers. I say, “Limited use,” because there is no way to get there without going through a smoking area, it has no Video Poker, no Table Games, no Game Kings and no bathrooms of its own.
The hotel check-in area as well as players club (same area) are non-smoking, as well as all eating areas. The buffet is non-smoking, but you cannot get to it without going across smoking areas of the casino floor. Also, the buffet line area is near some machines, so you’ve got some smoking there. Smoking is allowed near the cage, but that really doesn’t matter, because the only table games are in smoking areas, anyway.
What I am saying about this casino is that I can understand where non-smoking gamblers are coming from, because there really aren’t any areas that cater to them. On the other hand, I can’t imagine that the majority of them care very much, or they could just go to the casinos in Ohio that are non-smoking pursuant to State law.
2.) The Bars/Restaurants with Video Lottery Machines
These locations are a little more convoluted, but not really. The first thing that needs to be pointed out is that most places that would be considered primarily restaurants do not allow smoking at all because they do not have any machines. In fact, I can only think of one establishment that has a Video Lottery room (which allows smoking) that is a restaurant WITHOUT a bar in it. A few others are restaurants that at least have a bar.
Video Lottery machine rooms require that a person be 21 or older to enter them, pursuant to State law. Therefore, if an establishment has Video Lottery machines that are in the open (as opposed to in a separate room) then individuals under twenty-one are not allowed in there anyway. Such establishments, however, are pretty much exclusively parlors.
The Ohio County smoking ban does not allow indoor smoking in bars if those bars serve non pre-packaged food. That is the case regardless of whether or not the bar in question has a separate Video Lottery room. However, it must have a separate Video Lottery room in order for an individual to be allowed to smoke at the machines. I cannot think of one that doesn’t have a separate room, because then they could no longer allow smoking.***
***EDIT: Just thought of one. The Bridge Tavern on Main Street has a bar area and a restaurant area, as well as machines in the bar area, but the bar area is not a fully enclosed room. As a result, the Bridge Tavern may not allow smoking, but the owner of the establishment (to my recollection) never has allowed it, anyway.
3.) “Parlors”
Apparently, the term, “Parlors,” is somewhat of a local colloquialism, because nobody from outside of the area has any idea what I am talking about when I use that word. Either way, these are establishments that function for the primary purpose of offering West Virginia Video Lottery products. Some of these places are actually converted houses, but the vast majority of them are located in buildings that always housed some sort of business or restaurant.
Almost all of these places require an individual to be 21 or older to enter. The only ones where that is not the case are those that technically also function as restaurants, but in those cases, they have a separate room for machines. Of these few establishments, most of them are restaurants-in-name-only as their primary purpose is to function as a parlor.
Probably half of these parlors are such that one walks into the building and the machines are visible as soon as one steps through the door. Individuals under 21 years of age are not allowed in those establishments under any circumstances.
4.) Stores (Kind of)
There are a few convenience-type places that have a separate Video Lottery room in which smoking is allowed, but most of the establishment is non-smoking. I call them, “Stores,” because they have a few items, but mostly they just sell beer, pop/soda and tobacco products. Some of those establishments even have a drive-up window, and one must be 21 or older to be in the Video Lottery room, of course. I can think of at least two of these places that require one to be 21 just to be on the premises, at least, I’m making that observation based on the fact that they place such signage at the entrance.
So, there you have it. Those are the types of establishments in which someone may be exposed to smoking in Ohio County.
The only thing that I could see a reasonable argument being made for is to get rid of it in places that derive x% (or more) revenue from restaurant operations. One place, for example, is technically a, “Family Restaurant.” I would personally hate to see that go because you get free beverages and half off the entire menu for being in the parlor room playing, (which makes it a REALLY cheap lunch, because you can just play a nickel at a time) but I could understand disallowing that.
My personal opinion is that any establishment (such as some bars) in which a person must be 21 or older to even be inside should be allowed to continue to have smoking. I suppose the casino is something of a partial exception, because I think people should at least have a non-smoking gaming area and bathroom that can be accessed from outside without ever walking through a smoking area. I think smoking should be allowed anywhere else on the casino floor, though.
If you really want to see what a bunch of vacant buildings look like (as if there aren’t enough) just get rid of the allowance for parlors to have smoking and see what happens. Here today, gone tomorrow, half of them, promise.
Argument in Favor of Non-Smoking
Do they have a compelling argument?
Just kidding, they do.
Basically, they can point to any number of gambling jurisdictions in which the casinos continue to operate profitably, despite the fact that smoking is not allowed at any of the casinos. That is an argument that I partially concede.
I concede the argument to the extent that, yes, casinos can operate profitably. What should be noted, however, is that a number of casinos in states so affected have substantial smoking areas attached (directly) to the casino that are only technically outside. To wit, many of these areas have machines. Here are a few off of the top of my head:
- Mountaineer Casino-Chester, WV
- Rocky Gap Casino-Flintstone, MD
- Hollywood Casino-Columbus, OH
- Scioto Downs-Columbus, OH
Those are just a few examples of ones that have an area that is technically outside that STILL has slot machines! Many other casinos have smoking areas that are somewhat convenient to the casino itself, and in some, you can just smoke directly outside.
Mountaineer has, perhaps, the most impressive (?), “Outdoor,” smoking area. The area must take up at least half as much space as the general gaming floor and consists of easily 100 (maybe more) slot machines and a few dozen table games. It’s honestly pretty crazy, I have seen entire casinos that are almost as small as that, (Lady Luck Nemacolin) but they knew what they had to do and they did it.
I will give the health board some credit for at least not blowing smoke (that pun REALLY wasn’t intended) up everyone’s butt about the economic consequences. Basically, they put it right there on the table that they are being total idiots right now. Hey, at least they’re honest.
So, yes, non-smoking casinos do survive and operate profitably in some cases. It didn’t really work for Revel (which, admittedly, had a plethora of other problems) in Atlantic City, but it works sometimes. Other than Revel, there are not very many casinos that are willingly 100% non-smoking properties. Of those that have it forced upon them, many come up with some sort of, “Technically outside,” alternative. They probably wouldn’t be allowed to build a smoking building and a non-smoking building in many jurisdictions, for some stupid reason that I don’t care to know.
Competitive Disadvantage
I mentioned Columbus, OH earlier for a reason. Here’s an exercise for you unfamiliar with the geography of Ohio: Look at Columbus on the map.
While this is not true of all of the casino cities in Ohio, Columbus is in the most opportune place for a State that does not allow smoking at its casinos. I say that because they are dead center in the state, thus, there is no casino within two hours (Wheeling clocks in at just a little over) in which anyone would be able to smoke on most of the casino floor.
Columbus has a casino (Hollywood) and a racino (Scioto Downs) which are regulated differently. They have a few differences:
- No VP or Tables at Scioto
- No racetrack at Hollywood
Here are a two things that they have in common:
- Buffet
- Outdoor smoking area with a few machines
The fact of the matter is that if casinos have the capacity, in any way whatsoever to offer smoking, that is usually what they are going to do.
If the, “Adamant,” non-smokers are as unwilling to put up with smoking establishments as they claim to be, does it not stand to reason that casinos would be falling all over themselves to be certified non-smoking establishments even if they don’t have to be? Is there nobody who believes that, of the dozens of Las Vegas casinos, that...I don’t know....ONE of them might give 100% non-smoking a try?
The answer is no and that is because smoking is a positive (not for your health) action in the sense that it is something that people do. Even though a few gamblers might be compelled to visit one casino over another due to the status of smoking, there are many gamblers who are willing to take the extra time to go to a casino in which they can smoke.
Read that Intelligencer article about Wheeling Island if you like. Those are the numbers, that’s the reality. Smokers WILL actually vote with their feet and non-smokers, generally, will not.
There are a few reasons for that, actually. The first reason is because that many non-smokers view the casino as a pastime in which they spend discretionary income and understand that they don’t HAVE to be there. Despite the legality of casinos, many people still kind of view visiting them as, “being bad,” and they also realize it is a location exclusively for adults. In effect, no smoking in casinos would be like no cussing in strip clubs.
(You can cuss in strip clubs, right? I’ve been to two lifetime, each once.)
They may complain, but the fact of the matter is that they have not voted with their feet in sufficient enough droves to effectuate any change on the business’ end of things. The only way the non-smokers can get their way is through Legislative action. The smokers are more important (to gambling establishments) than they are...and they know it. They also seem not to care that WHEN establishments close, (as has happened to Hancock County parlors and many bars in Ohio County) there will be a negative impact on the local economy.
Smokers, on the other hand, feel that they should have the right to smoke in a casino because they are already participating in an activity that is exclusively for adults. It cannot be emphasized enough that they are willing to drive to the next nearest casino for the right to smoke in peace.
Again, I am all for no smoking in restaurants (but not bars in which one must be 21 to enter) because I believe that non-smokers should have the right to enjoy a meal without someone lighting up near them or a constant plume of smoke in the establishment.
We need to keep this within reason, though. Restaurants are not establishments designed exclusively for adults. They are establishments that are designed for anyone to enter and usually have no age restrictions of any kind. When we get into the potential for children to be exposed to direct second-hand smoke, then I definitely have a problem with that.
Smoking Demographics and Geographics
I’ve already touched upon this, but the inability to allow smoking would be devastating for Wheeling Island because there are two casinos within about an hour (Rivers, Meadows) and one within forty minutes (Meadows) that allow smoking. The smokers, at least those of whom that are able to drive, would just go to those establishments to gamble.
Another factor that comes into play are the demographics of a given area. It should be clear that the impact of not being able to allow smoking will be felt more strongly by casinos in geographical areas in which there is a greater than usual percentage of smokers.
Feel free to look up the numbers if you don’t believe me, but I can tell you unequivocally that Ohio County, West Virginia, has a greater percentage of smokers than the national average. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind about that. For that reason, it would be more detrimental for a casino located within the county not to allow smoking.
The existence of establishments with licensed and regulated West Virginia Video Lottery Terminals also presents a unique dynamic. While similar establishments can be found in a state such as Illinois, these establishments represent a significant portion of the state’s revenue by way of gambling revenue taxation. Furthermore, they represent a not insignificant percentage of the area’s overall employment. Perhaps worst of all, there’s no business that these establishments can easily be replaced with if they close.
I would say that, easily, one-quarter of business to have closed in Ohio County, West Virginia, within the last decade have not been replaced by anything. Moreover, many of these places were designed for the explicit purpose of functioning as slot parlors, so there really aren’t very many other business types that could even operate there if they wanted to.
The article focuses mostly on the casino itself, but I can assure you, the economic devastation that will follow if Ohio County goes 100% non-smoking will be much more widely felt than that. There are smaller sections of the City of Wheeling, and Ohio County in general, that have parlor establishments of this nature, and those establishments often support individuals who do not have automobiles and give them a means of employment. Some of these are in areas so out of the way that they are basically only serving a few hundred residents that live in the immediate area. If they are not there, then business-wise, nothing is there.
Opinion
My opinion is that the businesses and individuals should be allowed to do whatever they want as pertains smoking in an atmosphere and establishment that is designed for adults only.
If individual casinos arrive at the decision that it would be more profitable for them not to allow smoking, without it Legislatively being handed down to them, then that’s perfectly fine. They can abolish smoking in the casino and see how it goes.
If non-smokers decide that they absolutely cannot tolerate the presence of smoke in the casinos, that’s also fine. Rather than pursue Legislative remedy, they could simply attempt to effectuate change by not going. While I do believe casinos would benefit from meaningful non-smoking areas, should smoke-free gambling really rise to the level of being considered a fundamental, “Right?” Is it not an option for these people not to gamble at all if they don’t like the smoking? To me, it’s part and parcel, it’s like going to a strip club and complaining that they serve booze there.
Smokers should have the right to smoke in designated smoking areas in casinos that are willing to give them that right. That doesn’t mean that smoking is good for you, or exposure to second-hand smoke is advisable. It means that it is understood that gambling is a pastime of adults and in casinos, if nowhere else, smokers should also be allowed to enjoy that pastime (if I may call it that) in the only place they can outside of their own homes.
What do you guys think:
Should all casinos be non-smoking?
Should it be left up to the casinos?
Should non-smokers be allowed to pursue legislative remedy if the talking they do with their feet doesn’t cut it?
Should smoking in an adults-only establishment even be handled by the Government in any way?
Please let me know in the comments. Hopefully we can turn this into a conversation, and as always, thank you for reading!
jade 7 years ago Super Hero
I still smoke and I'm always surprised when smoking is allowed in a business establishment I am visiting. Even then. I may not light up if I'm the only one smoking. I remember the days when smoking wasn't an issue.....................
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Mission146 7 years ago Jr. Member
Pointman, I do because people want to be able to smoke at the machines. I think they should be able to do that, probably no matter what, but especially if a casino has a reasonable non-smoking area that has the same offerings as the smoking area. FridayHigh, I agree with your overall point, but don't really have...
Pointman, I do because people want to be able to smoke at the machines. I think they should be able to do that, probably no matter what, but especially if a casino has a reasonable non-smoking area that has the same offerings as the smoking area. FridayHigh, I agree with your overall point, but don't really have a problem with smoking being banned in indoor establishments where children could be. Kids have no choice but to go wherever their parents go. That's why I say any adults-only establishment should be allowed to have smoking if the business wants to.
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Pointman 7 years ago Jr. Member
That's a lot of money that Mountaineer lost. Normally, it looks cool when gambling, to have a cigarette. But the problem is that it affects those with you. So, as long as these casinos have a private place for smokers to finish their smokes then come back to gambling, I don't see a lot of hussle.
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Fridayhigh 7 years ago Newbie
Actually the whole thing is a load of bullocks. You can trace non smoking laws back to the 1964 civil right act. Which was supposedly to end discrimination. Well it was neither civil or nor did it grant anyone rights. In fact the exact opposite. There is more discrimination today than ever before. What it did do -(...
Actually the whole thing is a load of bullocks. You can trace non smoking laws back to the 1964 civil right act. Which was supposedly to end discrimination. Well it was neither civil or nor did it grant anyone rights. In fact the exact opposite. There is more discrimination today than ever before. What it did do -( you have to remember governments are not in the business of granting right! It's not theirs to grant) is give governments the rights over your private property and business. Telling you how to run your business and who you can and cannot do business with. This is a complete contrast to liberty. Now if the act was for public -tax funded establishments fair enough, but as said before, just another government grab nothing more, otherwise it would never pass. So either you have private property and or a private business or you don't. And as laws dictate today - you don't! THEY OWN YOU! Welcome to the land of the free!!! And smoking is of little importance to what is really at stake.
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Mission146 7 years ago Jr. Member
Sylvanas, Thanks for the comment! I wouldn't go as far as to say half, but we're definitely in agreement that there are many smokers that would go elsewhere, or nowhere at all, casino-wise. As far as your second statement, I would extend that to any adults-only establishment, whether they be casinos, bars or...
Sylvanas, Thanks for the comment! I wouldn't go as far as to say half, but we're definitely in agreement that there are many smokers that would go elsewhere, or nowhere at all, casino-wise. As far as your second statement, I would extend that to any adults-only establishment, whether they be casinos, bars or parlors.
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Sylvanas 7 years ago Admin
Heavy smoker here. No smoking rule for restaurants and other non-gaming areas in casinos is, of course, fine. But floors hell no. It would cut the traffic in half for sure, I'd just pass and play somewhere else. I assure you smokers who like to have a few drinks while playing will not be hanging in a non-smoking casino....
Heavy smoker here. No smoking rule for restaurants and other non-gaming areas in casinos is, of course, fine. But floors hell no. It would cut the traffic in half for sure, I'd just pass and play somewhere else. I assure you smokers who like to have a few drinks while playing will not be hanging in a non-smoking casino. It seems most reasonable to let casinos decide whether or not to allow smoking.
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